General Hospital - MESSAGE BOARDS

Quote NewWaterfordGirl:

Very well said and I totally agree. I find the hypocrisy on the show difficult to tolerate, but in the last few days it hit a whole new level. I find the whole anger-revenge thing that they are showcasing is very different that having violence to prevent violence. The retaliation and "violent begets violence" is wearing very thin as well as the fact that Sonny and Jason's crimes are shown to be "justice and justified" whereas the crimes of others against them is evil.

This dynamic epitomizes a key element of what is wrong with GH, IMHO. That is the fact that one or two criminals are held up to be the moral authority. Other criminals have to be more evil to justify Jason and Sonny's actions. The difference here was that there were layers with Johnny and Claudia, as there always are in life. It wasn't black and white. As such, the hypocrisy was highlighted. I really want the moral authority to be taken out of the hands of the mobsters.

What also got to me was the fact that Jason and Sonny were talking about evidence and using terminology that the police/FBI should be using. Not mobsters. I want to see the moral authority and competence and ownership of investigations taken out of the hands of mobsters.

Quote genhospchat:

Wow this is a hard one because no matter what I say, I will be called biased because I have enjoyed the dynamic of the character of Jason for 15 years or so (not meaning you Cincy) so I will answer how "I" feel (and I am hoping people will actually READ what I am saying and not jump on me automatically) and will set it up to get to the question...you know me, no easy, short, quick posts and I can't keep Liz's name out of it because she is Jake's mom BUT I won't make any comparisions (and gosh, yes, I hope that no one turns this into a war).

To me, ALL the mistakes with the kids happened because of Sonny. The fact that Michael is how he is, to me, is because of Sonny, not Jason. Carly trusted Jason with Michael and while Jason had Michael, he was ALWAYS safe, there was NEVER a problem with him (keeping in mind, at that time, Jason was the one running the "business." Sonny wasn't even in town anymore and Jason hadn't been in the business for long at this point). It was when Sonny took over as Michael's father and SHOWED MICHAEL that the way to live was revenge and anger.

Sonny's temper is one of his shortcomings as it makes for LOUSY decisions and him acting before thinking. These thoughts created the last mob war that had Jake kidnapped for a second time (let's be honest, that had NOTHING to do with Jason and that whole story of them going after Jake because they saw Jason and Liz hugging???? GMAB!!), had Claudia going off the deep end the other day (not to mention showing him threatening someone in a room full of people, causing innocent bystanders to be placed in harm's way AGAIN), caused Michael to run away after shooting Kate, bringing Michael to a warehouse without any guards, covering Kate and not Michael when Devlin shot at them, attacking and holding Johnny hostage for something he had NO PROOF on when in turn it was his OWN SON who shot Kate, etc (all of these things put children in danger).

Jason has ALWAYS made sure that the kids were safe while in his care. If Carly and Sam BOTH trusted their kids to Jason and he was willing to take care of them, there's NO REASON that he couldn't do that for his OWN son. When Jason was running the "business", he showed that he could take care of business without the violence. He went after AZ by burning down his house, not killing him or acting irrationally. Jason wanted the violence to STOP and just to run the "business" in as peaceful a way as is possible.

NOW do I think that Jason made the right choice? I UNDERSTAND the reasoning for it BUT do I think it's right...NO! I will explain my reasoning for this by the events leading up to it (I will keep it as short as I can but again, it is ME and I'm sure I will repeat myself).

I have NEVER bought the fact that Jason was "partially guilty" for Michael being in "that life." Jason and Robin took care of Michael while Carly dealt with her PPD, Jason lying to everyone that he was Michael's father (Remember the scene when social services came to Sonny's PH and Jason, Bobbie, Robin and the guards were putting together baby furniture? This was one of the reasons that Jason was shown to WANT the best life for Michael, even while working in the mob). He went as far as to name him himself. When Carly got out, she wanted Jason for herself but we know that Jason wanted Robin. Jason and Robin broke up and later Jason started feeling bad because he felt that he should be with Carly to help raise Michael (he wasn't in love with Carly but he wanted the baby to have a father and he VOLUNTEERED, with no thought of "danger, danger") but then of course Carly seeing Liz and Jason dancing, she went "all-Carly", went to Sonny's to find out info on the two of them and then slept with Sonny in anger. That night Jason got shot, he went to Sonny's to tell him what happened and found out the two had slept together and decided to say goodbye to Sonny, Carly and the mob (and SBu left GH).

When Jason came back almost a year later (I don't remember EXACT dates), Carly had had a miscarriage from the baby with Sonny after their night of "anger sex" and they had fallen in love. Jason saw this and said that the two of them should try to work it out and had told Sonny (paraphrasing), "I am entrusting Michael to you and you take care of him and keep him safe" (remembering that while in Jason's care, he was always safe). From that point on, Sonny and Carly were responsible for Michael's upbringing and safety and it wasn't Jason's responsibility anymore (though Jason was always there for Michael and even moved in across the hall).

Next Sam and Sonny's baby. Jason CHOSE HIMSELF to take responsibility of someone else's baby. HE HIMSELF, AGAIN, made up the lie that he was the father of SOMEONE ELSE'S baby. He made it known that HE WAS THE FATHER to anyone who asked and made a vow to keep that baby safe, with no worries of the "danger, danger". (Now let's keep in mind here, Jason couldn't stand Sam at that time but was doing it to save Sonny and Carly's marriage and to keep Michael happy. Frankly I thought it was time someone allowed that kid to see that life isn't roses and rainbows and allowed the kid a dose of reality at that time).

NOW we have TWO babies that aren't even his that he is telling the world that ARE HIS. He isn't talking of the danger, he isn't worried about his enemies, he wasn't hiding anything (well Michael's paternity but that's neither here nor there at this moment). He was going to marry Sam, a woman he didn't even like, for the sake of this baby...again that wasn't his and that he VOLUNTEERED to raise. As we know, Jason and Sam started having feelings for each other and he was looking forward to being a father. (Again, voluntarily).

Jason and Sam were going to adopt a baby, Hope (Hope's real mom eventually took the baby back). No one was pregnant but he was going to take a stranger's baby and raise this baby as his own (again, VOLUNTARILY). There was no thought to "danger, danger" this time EITHER. This wasn't someone lying about a paternity, this was Jason CHOOSING to bring this baby into his home and raise it as his own (third child that wasn't his but was willing to raise as his AGAIN with no thought to "danger, danger").

Fast forward to Jake. Jason wanted Jake whether he was his son or not, he said these words himself. He wanted to marry Liz and them to be a family and HE VOLUNTARILY raise help the baby (one that may or may not have been his, with NO thought of "danger, danger"). It was found out in time that Jason WAS Jake's daddy but because Lucky already thought the baby was his, Liz decided to keep it that way because she wanted to help Lucky stay sober (not because of the "danger, danger" issue).

In time, Liz realized that her feelings for Jason wouldn't go away and that she and Lucky shouldn't be together. The lie was already told Lucky was the father and they decided to just leave it that way Jason kept making declarations that his life was too dangerous for having children in his life and pushed this point and eventually Liz started thinking it herself and agreed BUT Liz and Jason KNEW that they wanted each other and snuck around. Eventually Liz realized that Jason could keep them all safe and was pushing for them to be together, out in the open, and the two decided to marry, FOR REAL, for LOVE and she pushed the issue with Jason and he as well KNEW that Jason COULD keep them all safe.

SUDDENLY there were all these dangerous situations that happened (Kate got shot, Michael got shot, the mob war that made NO SENSE) that made them both decide it was better to part (keeping in mind, NONE of these were because of Jason but because of Sonny). Liz and Jason were still in love and were breaking up ONLY BECAUSE it was to keep Jake safe (where were all these "danger, danger" issues when he was willing to raise everyone else's children?). Now IMO, all these were just set up to break up Liz and Jason (and to make sure Jason wouldn't be "domesticated," Fron's words not mine) and make sure that Jason looked like a COMPLETELY different person than who he REALLY was (all of the above tells you that).

Ok this is where it will get hairy (please everyone let's not make this about Sam is better for Jason because that is neither here nor there). Many will agree, and many won't, that the fact that Jason walked away from Jake, after everything I said above about Michael, Hope and Sam's baby, was OOC for Jason. (I am not saying this to start an argument or to make this a back and forth but AGAIN, how "I" feel, since I was asked). The fact that Jason would pretend his child does not exist but is STILL running around town for EVERYONE ELSE'S children (not to mention Mexico for a child that the mother doesn't even want him around), to me also, makes Jason OOC, not to mention hypocritical. I UNDERSTAND that he wants to protect his OWN child BUT is seeking vengeance and is mad at HIMSELF for how another person's child was raised, that had nothing to do with him as to why Michael is how he is or why things happened as they did (again, this was because of Sonny)?

Do "I" think that Jason could have kept Jake safe...ABSOLUTELY and I STILL do. I believed that Jason could take care of Sam's baby, Hope and Michael with no problem as to the safety of them, so why wouldn't I believe that he could, not to mention WOULD WANT TO, for the sake of HIS OWN child?

Jason could have continued running the mob HIS WAY AND been a parent as well (heck he's did it before with Michael). He WASN'T irrational like Sonny, he thought first, got the information he needed, checked it again, thought some more and THEN retaliated if he felt it is necessary (ANOTHER reason people say Jason is OOC). No one (meaning enemies) wanted to go up against Jason and they all knew Jason was fair and that things would go smoothly with Jason so people didn't interfere with Jason. SONNY brought in and created the enemies that retaliated and made things in PC ugly, NOT Jason. There is no reason that Jason couldn't have his cake (literally - "Cake") and eat it too. I also believe that Sonny could IF Sonny wasn't a fly off the handle and selfish guy. Everything that has EVER happened to any of the kids, was PERSONAL TO SONNY, not because of "mob business".

Again, the fact that they had to change Jason's personality to make sure he couldn't raise his son (he has become irrational, has no thought for other's safety, reacts before thinking, etc, etc)is a thorn in my side. I still believe that Jason POSSIBLY MAY have become this way BECAUSE he can't have his son and is thinking irrationally because he is tired of trying to do it all and just wants it all to END! I really believe Jason wants out of the mob (even though he says he can't, though he has done it before) and just wants the violence to stop. I think that all the strain of his life in the mob, as well as not being able to have the one person he most wants in his life is taking it's toll. It's just too bad that they are having to ruin his character and I hope that this (or something else that makes equal sense or that is ALSO the reasoning for it) explains WHY he has turned into Sonny and has lost most of himself from the last 15 years. (I know many won't agree that he is OOC but from everything I've said, it has SHOWN that in the last year Jason has become OOC and is not the same person he has always been).

There is no reason if Jason could keep Michael, Hope and Sam's baby safe (while in his care as the parent), not of which were his child, that he couldn't with Jake as well.

Btw, thank you Cincy and I'm glad you enjoyed my last post. I'm not even sure if I answered your question or not. LOL

Quote toy1975: Sorry but the real JASON would NEVER allow some other man to raise his SON/Family is one of the REAL Jason strong point!BUT I guess Jasam fan would see it as IT was OK what Sam did to Liz/Jake/Cam since no one was hurt BUT I know what GUNS pointed at people can/will do THEY GO OFF..No one can predict what will go down.NOWEVER sam went out of her way and prey that Jake was dead/she wanted him gone SAD a small baby who never did 1 bad thing to anyone all b/c he holds this bio fathers heart!Sam is EVIL and has never paid for her wrongs ONLY to have TIIC whitewash her up and PREY the STINK will go away!SORRY but when TIIC has to pimp this hard to have viewers swollow her crap SHE IS NOT WORKING!So you JASAM fans SAY what makes you feel better BUT the FACTS remain the same and NO amount of whitewashing will change that!TIIC needs to cut their lose and MOVE ahead with KeMo bring down the ratings/SOON GH will cancell itself OUT!MAYBE this si what ABC is HOPEING for WHO knows!

Quote toy1975:

YES I know its a SOAP...NOWEVER being that I have watched this soap FROM DAY 1 (46yrs) and all the $$$ and Time I have invested its more then JUST a soap to me:):)I'am just saying in all that time I have NEVER EVER seen TIIC work so hard/redo/change history/redoing other character IN ORDER for 1 charcater to WORK(well lack of work IMO) when it comes to KeMo/Sam..HAD anyone OTHER then KeMo played SAM she would of been GONE 6yrs ago!Sorry ME I rather TIIC stop the BS kill Sam off and USE the VETS in more storyline where they belong/NOT put Sam in EVERYONE business/putting her in everyone S/L where she doesnt make sense being ME I CALL THAT PIMPING....OF COURSE like everyone else THIS IS IMHO and MY RIGHT to have it!LOL

Quote toy1975:

NO don't fool YOURSELF think she has all these FANS...WHY do you THINK TIIC is PUSHING Jason with Sam???LOL YUP b/c without Jason SAM is NOTHING!AND of COURSE for REASON one MIGHT question why ol why is FRONZ BOY in her CORNER UHmmm so many question with FEWer answers!IT surly is NOT her her acting or lack of it that keeps her around!BUT TO QUOTE YOUR WORDS UHMM ITS JUST A SOAP:)

Quote toy1975:

NO don't fool YOURSELF think she has all these FANS...WHY do you THINK TIIC is PUSHING Jason with Sam???LOL YUP b/c without Jason SAM is NOTHING!AND of COURSE for REASON one MIGHT question why ol why is FRONZ BOY in her CORNER UHmmm so many question with FEWer answers!IT surly is NOT her her acting or lack of it that keeps her around!BUT TO QUOTE YOUR WORDS UHMM ITS JUST A SOAP:)

Quote genhospchat:

Oh and I worked so hard to not do comparisions of the two in regards to Jason considering the comment about Jason was about Jake, not Liz or Sam and Cincy asked that it not be about Sam vs Liz. *sigh* Can of worms opened!

Quote toy1975:

What Iam saying is KeMo was pushed without much thought on the canver COMING to the soap..TIIC amitted that much...KeMo is only as good as the material she was given and IMO it wasnt much so I see a lack in her character...IMO HAD TIIC kept her in her true form a CON who came to town played a hard butt kind a girl IT COULD of WORKED.TELL me what would of been so wring with that)?.BUT no TIIC RUSHED her in and falled to BRING KeMO OUT in a better light!RATINGS are BAD and all I see is JASAM who are FRONT and CENTER..THEIR MEXICO SEX which was in every commerical/mags only got a 1.7 when many waited to see Jason SHIRTLESS that is what so sad!IMO KeMo is not up to powder these days can it be she has a lot on her plate?CAN BE!So yes IMHO It will show up in her or ANYONES acting!

Quote ghfanfare

When I read this part of your post, I had a vision of a gray-haired Sonny issuing orders bent over a walker and an old wrinkled Jason shuffling to the rescue with a cane...LOL!

Quote cincyghfan

I dont think Jake is going to remember being kidnapped or the thugs in the park. He was just an infant during that time. There is a chance he could remember Sam saving his life when the cabin exploded.

But give it time I am sure 15 more terrible things will happen to Jake before it is all said and done... such is the life of a kid in PC.